debka_notion: (Default)
debka_notion ([personal profile] debka_notion) wrote2009-02-03 09:02 pm

Feminist Complaint

1. On an academic note, the following quote from Jacob Neusner's article "Scripture and Tradition": "If we regard the Mishnah as independent revelation, "oral Torah" in teh strict sense, then we must deem tradition to be a kind of Torah.  If we regard the Mishnah as contingent, then tradition stands in a very close and comfortable bond with Scripture: Scripture's companion, complement, necessary consequence.  So the Mishnah may be deemed (to invoke the appropriate metaphor) depending upon the position you take, to be the daughter of Scripture or the wife." 

Very little probably needs to be said about why this particular set of sentences riles me up.  But I have to say, it really, really irks me. 

[identity profile] tovaks.livejournal.com 2009-02-04 02:14 am (UTC)(link)
As you know, I'm not well-schooled in these sorts of things, but that rubs even me the wrong way.
ext_27060: Sumer is icomen in; llude sing cucu! (Daughter of Eve)

[identity profile] rymenhild.livejournal.com 2009-02-04 02:25 am (UTC)(link)
Ugh!
ext_8883: jasmine:  a temple would be nice (Default)

[identity profile] naomichana.livejournal.com 2009-02-04 02:34 am (UTC)(link)
Urgh. One need not be a feminist to find that offensive on several levels.

Although now I am trying to work out whether that means Torah has an obligation to marry the Mishnah off before age 12 or merely an obligation to feed it, clothe it, periodically delight it, and pay through the nose in the event of divorce. (Note to self: stop thinking about Nashim.)

[identity profile] belu.livejournal.com 2009-02-04 03:17 am (UTC)(link)
*chuckle*

And I agree—offensive, and superfluous to boot. Reading that, I felt he'd already made his point.

[identity profile] boroparkpyro.livejournal.com 2009-02-04 03:18 am (UTC)(link)
(Note to self: stop thinking about Nashim.)

Someone should make a poster of that ;-)

[identity profile] margavriel.livejournal.com 2009-02-04 02:56 am (UTC)(link)
Prof. Neusner is known to be an incredibly unpleasant, obnoxious, horrible person, who has hurt many people in the past. It does not surprise me at all that he is not sensitive to feminist concerns -- and therefore, it doesn't bother me.

[identity profile] shirei-shibolim.livejournal.com 2009-02-04 03:02 am (UTC)(link)
I think the Mar has a point. Polemical pieces I've read by Neusner have been uniformly obnoxious, so this isn't too shocking.

[identity profile] margavriel.livejournal.com 2009-02-04 03:11 am (UTC)(link)
Oh, and BTW, I was at your school's library today! Didn't see you, though.

[identity profile] hatam-soferet.livejournal.com 2009-02-04 03:13 am (UTC)(link)
Yeah...Neusner's an arsehole. You're allowed to assume that more or less everything he says is bollocks, especially if it involves Palestinian Aramaic.

[identity profile] gimmelgirl.livejournal.com 2009-02-04 03:50 am (UTC)(link)
To add to what's been said about Neusner ...
I'm sure since he wrote that, he's wrote 84 more books that say something different...

"Hi, May I speak with Mr. Neusner?"
"I'm sorry, he's writing a book right now."
"That's okay, I'll hold."

[identity profile] margavriel.livejournal.com 2009-02-04 02:12 pm (UTC)(link)
No, they all say the same thing.

[identity profile] rav-hadassah.livejournal.com 2009-02-04 09:53 am (UTC)(link)
He sounds like a real charmer!

The daughter metaphor... OK... but the wife metaphor? Not cool.

You cannot expect a parent-child relationship to be completely egalitarian. But a spousal relationship... oy vey.

[identity profile] cynara-linnaea.livejournal.com 2009-02-08 01:12 pm (UTC)(link)
Whee, Neusner bashing! Is there a group of people (other than amei haaretz who don't hate him?

The only thing I have to add is that if you type in Neusner to the search bar on Amazon, the third option it offers is "neusner rabbi jesus." While this is obviously a result of his book of a similar title, I still find it hilarious.